Her name means "The Seventh Daughter" or "The Daughter of Oath"
Can a sistah just get some “me” time! This mere request seems to have been impossible even during the times that we just read about (smile). The story of Bathsheba , “Sheba.” as a couple of our ladies have so affectionately called her in daily conversation, was certainly filled with many twists and turns. Our text states that her beauty made her a victim of the King David’s wrong doing, but with a king like David, it makes you wonder if it really would have mattered.
In Friday’s reading our author has written about abuse and its many forms. Could Bathsheba have possibly been a victim of abuse? While the story left me yearning to know more about “Sheba,” I guess the answers that lie between the lines that you write will have to suffice.
Please feel free to answer one or all of the questions below. You may also include additional comments that you would like to share:
1. What might Bathsheba have been thinking when David’s men came to get her? Could she have said no to David the king?
(See Trina's comment-- Great observation!).
2. What part do you think Bathsheba played in the events outlined in these verses? Totally innocent? Artful seductress? Or something in between? (See Roslyn’s comments—very interesting).
3. Describe how you think Bathsheba probably felt when she realized she was pregnant with David’s child. Why did she immediately tell David?
Read 2 Samuel 11:6-27; 12:13
4. These verses outline in frightening detail the depth to which David would go to cover up his sin with Bathsheba. How could God possibly say that David was a “man after my own heart” (Acts 13:22)?
5. Describe a time when you were the innocent victim. How did you “pick up the pieces” even though you weren’t at fault?
17 comments:
Hello Group,
I know this may be a lot of reading, but I read this article along with my studies of Bathsheba. I found it very interesting to know that Bathsheba may not have been as innocent or helpless as some may think. Typically in traditional Jewish culture sex is primarily a woman's right not a man's. Also David being a man who followed God knows that sext outside of marriage is forbidden in the Jewish Law books. It is possible that Bathsheba could have resisted David's request. The Bible doesn't say that David forced Bathsheba to lay with him. Something to think about Ladies. :-)
Kosher Sex
Note: This page addresses issues of Jewish law that may not be appropriate for younger readers. In places, it discusses sexual behavior in plain and frank terms. Please exercise appropriate discretion.
Jewish Attitudes Towards Sexuality
In Jewish law, sex is not considered shameful, sinful or obscene. Sex is not thought of as a necessary evil for the sole purpose of procreation. Although sexual desire comes from the yetzer ra (the evil impulse), it is no more evil than hunger or thirst, which also come from the yetzer ra. Like hunger, thirst or other basic instincts, sexual desire must be controlled and channeled, satisfied at the proper time, place and manner. But when sexual desire is satisfied between a husband and wife at the proper time, out of mutual love and desire, sex is a mitzvah.
Sex is permissible only within the context of a marriage. In Judaism, sex is not merely a way of experiencing physical pleasure. It is an act of immense significance, which requires commitment and responsibility. The requirement of marriage before sex ensures that sense of commitment and responsibility. Jewish law also forbids sexual contact short of intercourse outside of the context of marriage, recognizing that such contact will inevitably lead to intercourse.
The primary purpose of sex is to reinforce the loving marital bond between husband and wife. The first and foremost purpose of marriage is companionship, and sexual relations play an important role. Procreation is also a reason for sex, but it is not the only reason. Sex between husband and wife is permitted (even recommended) at times when conception is impossible, such as when the woman is pregnant, after menopause, or when the woman is using a permissible form of contraception.
In the Torah, the word used for sex between husband and wife comes from the root Yod-Dalet-Ayin, meaning "to know," which vividly illustrates that proper Jewish sexuality involves both the heart and mind, not merely the body.
Nevertheless, Judaism does not ignore the physical component of sexuality. The need for physical compatibility between husband and wife is recognized in Jewish law. A Jewish couple must meet at least once before the marriage, and if either prospective spouse finds the other physically repulsive, the marriage is forbidden.
Sex should only be experienced in a time of joy. Sex for selfish personal satisfaction, without regard for the partner's pleasure, is wrong and evil. A man may never force his wife to have sex. A couple may not have sexual relations while drunk or quarreling. Sex may never be used as a weapon against a spouse, either by depriving the spouse of sex or by compelling it. It is a serious offense to use sex (or lack thereof) to punish or manipulate a spouse.
Sex is the woman's right, not the man's. A man has a duty to give his wife sex regularly and to ensure that sex is pleasurable for her. He is also obligated to watch for signs that his wife wants sex, and to offer it to her without her asking for it. The woman's right to sexual intercourse is referred to as onah, and it is one of a wife's three basic rights (the others are food and clothing), which a husband may not reduce. The Talmud specifies both the quantity and quality of sex that a man must give his wife. It specifies the frequency of sexual obligation based on the husband's occupation, although this obligation can be modified in the ketubah (marriage contract). A man may not take a vow to abstain from sex for an extended period of time, and may not take a journey for an extended period of time, because that would deprive his wife of sexual relations. In addition, a husband's consistent refusal to engage in sexual relations is grounds for compelling a man to divorce his wife, even if the couple has already fulfilled the halakhic obligation to procreate.
Although sex is the woman's right, she does not have absolute discretion to withhold it from her husband. A woman may not withhold sex from her husband as a form of punishment, and if she does, the husband may divorce her without paying the substantial divorce settlement provided for in the ketubah.
Although some sources take a more narrow view, the general view of halakhah is that any sexual act that does not involve sh'chatat zerah (destruction of seed, that is, ejaculation outside the vagina) is permissible. As one passage in the Talmud states, "a man may do whatever he pleases with his wife." (Nedarim 20b) In fact, there are passages in the Talmud that encourage foreplay to arouse the woman. (Nedarim 20a). Any stories you may have heard about Jewish sex occurring through a hole in a sheet are purely an urban legend.
Niddah: The Laws of Separation
One of the most mysterious areas of Jewish sexual practices is the law of niddah, separation of husband and wife during the woman's menstrual period. These laws are also known as taharat ha-mishpachah, family purity. Few people outside of the Orthodox community are even aware that these laws exist, which is unfortunate, because these laws provide many undeniable benefits. The laws of niddah are not deliberately kept secret; they are simply unknown because most non-Orthodox Jews do not continue their religious education beyond bar mitzvah, and these laws address subjects that are not really suitable for discussion with children under the age of 13.
According to the Torah, a man is forbidden from having sexual intercourse with a niddah, that is, a menstruating woman. This is part of the extensive laws of ritual purity described in the Torah. At one time, a large portion of Jewish law revolved around questions of ritual purity and impurity. The law of niddah is the only law of ritual purity that continues to be observed today; all of the other laws applied only when the Temple was in existence, but are not applicable today.
The time of separation begins at the first sign of blood and ends in the evening of the woman's seventh "clean day." This separation lasts a minimum of 12 days. The Torah prohibits only sexual intercourse, but the rabbis broadened this prohibition, maintaining that a man may not even touch his wife or sleep in the same bed as her during this time. Weddings must be scheduled carefully, so that the woman is not in a state of niddah on her wedding night.
At the end of the period of niddah, as soon as possible after nightfall after the seventh clean day, the woman must immerse herself in a kosher mikvah, a ritual pool. The mikvah was traditionally used to cleanse a person of various forms of ritual impurity. Today, it is used primarily for this purpose and as part of the ritual of conversion, though in some communities observant men periodically immerse themselves for reasons of ritual purity.
It is important to note that the mikvah provides only ritual purification, not physical cleanliness; in fact, immersion in the mikvah is not valid unless the woman is thoroughly bathed before immersion. The mikvah is such an important part of traditional Jewish ritual life that traditionally a new community would build a mikvah before they would build a synagogue.
The Torah does not specify the reason for the laws of niddah, but this period of abstention has both physical and psychological benefits.
The fertility benefits of this practice are obvious and undeniable. In fact, it is remarkable how closely these laws parallel the advice given by medical professionals today. When couples are having trouble conceiving, modern medical professionals routinely advise them to abstain from sex during the two weeks around a woman's period (to increase the man's sperm count at a time when conception is not possible), and to have sex on alternate nights during the remaining two weeks. When you combine this basic physical benefit with the psychological benefit of believing that you are fulfilling G-d's will, it is absolutely shocking that more couples with fertility problems do not attempt this practice. The rejection of this practice by the liberal movements of Judaism is not a matter of "informed choice," but simply a matter of ignorance or blind prejudice.
In addition, women who have sexual intercourse during their menstrual period are more vulnerable to a variety of vaginal infections, as well as increased risk of cervical cancer.
But the benefits that the rabbis have always emphasized are the psychological ones, not the physical ones. The rabbis noted that a two-week period of abstention every month forces a couple to build a non-sexual bond as well as a sexual one. It helps to build the couple's desire for one another, making intercourse in the remaining two weeks more special. It also gives both partners a chance to rest, without feeling sexually inadequate. They also emphasized the value of self-discipline in a drive as fundamental as the sexual drive.
© Copyright 5756-5760 (1995-1999), Tracey R Rich
Hey Ladies,
I totally agree that Bathsheba may not have been totally innocent. I did read the article that you posted and it was truly interesting. What I gather from it is that the women had the sexual right, not the men, in the confounds of their marriage. However, during this time, women were considered powerless. Also, with David being the King, Bathsheba did not have the right to refuse to come to him when he sent for her. Also, the King was very powerful and any refusal to his request could have resulted in her demise "off with your head" :-). If Bathsheba was a woman of God, it would have been easier for her to stand up to the King as did Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego. I see David as the victimizer as he was King and should have been at war with his troops. Bathsheba was bathing in her own courtyard where she should have expected privacy. The Bible states that David sent for her and lay with her, which can be interpreted as "rape". It did not indicate that they lay with each other which is another indicator that David had all of the control. Things that make you go hmmmmmmmmmm.
Hello Ladies,
To say the least, these comments, along with the story of Bethsheba were truly a good read and most enlightening. However, I’d like to view this from a different angel, namely Nathan’s message in a parable from God to David. I used that to help me draw my conclusion with respect to whether Bethsheba was forced or volunteered to lie with David.
I’ll start by pointing out a major factor. In the parable by the prophet Nathan (2 Samuel 12:1-9), Bethsheba was symbolically the “ewe lamb” God referenced. A ewe lamb, or a lamb in its own right is harmless, innocent and more over referred to biblically as “precious.” Jesus himself is referred to as the “precious lamb” countless times in the Bible. Was Bethsheba truly a victim? Here again, this parable refers to a rich man and a poor man. David being the rich man, who misused his authority and power; we can determine that from the parable as well. The poor man in this instance was Uriah; the parable states that the little ewe lamb was all that the poor man owned. It also states that the poor man loved the ewe lamb, nourished it, that they ate and drank of the same cup (Roslyn’s comment) and entreated it as a daughter. Well, that’s a mouthful! Given that, we can safely assume that Uriah was a loving and devoted husband that could not have neglected his wife.
The Bible states, some things are inferred; clearly we can assume that Bethsheba was a satisfied wife. Uriah would not lie with his wife after David’s deception, because he was an honorable man. As Trina mentioned, David himself should have been with his camp leading his troops at battle as king. Instead, he decided to stay behind for what ever reason. Remember when we’re not doing what we should tends to leave room for mishap. An idled mind is the devil’s workshop.
Finally, I came to peace knowing that sometimes we’ll never have all the facts. And most times, God provides us with only what we need to know as a lesson that none of us can ever be perfect in deed. The reference in the parable of Bethsheba being interpreted as a ewe lamb put my questions to rest. In short, this woman was left mourning the loss of a husband in battle; a death of a new born child to illness yet she becomes the queen of a powerful nation and in the end bore a king that reign over Israel and from the genealogy the ultimate KING would be born. How powerful is that! I can only draw one biblical theory here . . . God provides for the just and the unjust alike and has know respect of person. Points to ponder:)
Answers to questions regarding the study of Bathsheba.
1. Bathsheba was likely nervous and curious as to why the King was sending for her. She could have said no but there probably would have been some repercussions behind denying the King.
2. I think Bathsheba was the innocent victim.
3. Bathsheba probably felt several emotions, including fear, anger and guilt. She told David, "I am with child". She did not try to hide the situation because she knew it would soon be revealed and because David caused the problem, he needed to know. Why should she carry this burden alone. Also, during this time, she would have been killed if she had become pregnant while her husband was out to battle. Hence, the reason for David trying to cover up because he knew that it would lead back to him since he was not at war with his men.
4. God searches the heart and knew that David was really a good man, although he was weak to the flesh. We all struggle with some sort of sin but it doesn't mean that we are not God fearing individuals and that we do not truly love and trust God.
5. I remember being violated when I was 19 years old, through no fault of my own. I was angry but I knew that I had to forgive and move forward with my life. As a result, I feel I'm a much better person and I truly can say that I know what it feels like to struggle with forgiving someone who has wronged you.
I do not know if Bathsheba was innocently seduced by David. We as women, we got to be on the watch in the Lord's church. I know of a preacher who got a woman pregnant in the church. He has a wife and 4 children. Also of another one who left his wife and children to married a sister from the congregation where he was preaching. These types of problems are vividly taking place in our Lord's church. As the Bible says, there is nothing new under the sun. As Bathsheba, I do not know what role these women played in these events. One of these preachers was preaching a sermon on this particular lesson of David and Bathsheba. After I found out about his behavior, I realized he was bragging about his behavior and was justifying it with the lesson he was preaching! Ladies, we need to pray without ceasing!
Marilyn
I know of the problems of not obeying the King, but with David we don't see that treacherous side of him until he kills Uriah, which was an act of desperation to cover his sin. I am being told that women in the Jewish tradition have a right to say no and it's not a death threat. I guess we'll never know fully, but this is a wonderful example of how you can never say what you won't do. This is truly something that makes you go hmmmm.:-) I love blogging with you ladies.
Hi Ladies,
I observed great comments. I will agree that Sheba was innocent. She was minding her own business w/some ME-Time and little did she know that a mere man,(although a King)was watching her. He was sowing to his human fleashly desires not caring about wrong or right. That was his thorne! which brought upon an everlasting curse. But,yet he was a man after God's heart.(consequences are always at the back door)and No! Sheba could not turn the King down or else.. Do or Die! (Consequences) Thoughts that make u go HHHMMM...
Hey yawww,
I don't know if I did this right or not but I'm trying (smile) I shall soon find out. Guess Who?
Hmmmm, was she really that innocent? Although, David had his men to approach Bathsheba because she was so desirable to his eyes, could she possibly have been flattered that a king such as David desired her. King David had the favor and blessing of God upon his life, he was fine, ladies... and probably hard to resist (smile) anyway.....getting back to my girl, Bathsheba, she had the choice to reject and resist David, but I think there was an attraction by both. Yea they did the nasty upon David's strong manly desire, but evidently Bathsheba must have enjoyed the experience and found herself in David's arms more than once.
Bathsheba may have justified the act by believing she had to carry out the kings request.....yea right! Ladies we all know we send nonverbal signals to men to let them know if they can approach us or not. As innocently as we think Bathsheba appeared in the Bible, I think she enticed David to make him desire her more! I agree with Roslyn, the Bible does not state that David forced Bathsheba to lay with him. I think she desired him as he did her.
Come on ladies, I know there have been men that we have considered, but we did not carry out the lustful thoughts. We all make choices as Bathsheba did. Is there a price for sin? Of course, but God is a forgiving God.
Hey Sistahs, sorry I am all late responding, but after reading about Bathsheba twice, I can't help but to say that I believe she was a victim of King David's power and arrogance. Not saying she was raped, but I do think she was inocent. You see, if you read closely to the story, Bathsheba was bathing and thinking of her husband Uriah, who was camped out at Rabagh sp). David (who should have been away at war too) noticed a figure bathing that he wanted more info on. So what did he do?, he did some investigating and found out that the figure bathing was Bathsheba. I honestly believe that when King David's men came to get her, she may have been thinking "Has something happened to my husband Uriah" she was already thinking of him and now these men who should be away are bringing her to the King. The bible doesnt not go heavily into detail of what happend, all it says is that he lay down with her and she became pregnant. Whether it was consensual or rape, we don't know. One thing we have to remember is what we consider "rape" today, may have been something different in those days. If Sheba rejected David, I am sure she would have suffered the consequences. I don't want to ramble on, so to sum it up, since we already know the story, is that Bathsheba's blessing came to her when she became a powerful queen herself and the mother of King Solomon, which to me reveals that she was inocent in the matter. David was wrong, and he suffered the consequences. Yes Sheba and Dave lost a son, but I do believe it was to punish King Dave not necessarily to punish Sheba although she suffered the loss as well. What yall sistahs think??
One definite lesson that can certainly be learned from the story of Bathsheba is the mercy that God showed to David after he tried to cover up his sin. While I feel that Bathsheba was used as a pawn, the act of forgiveness rings loud and clear in this story, as God wants us to repent of our sins so that he can forgive us. We have people who throw us under the bus on a regular basis. Yes, there are even those who have attempted to have others sign their own death sentence as David did with Uriah, but remember that it is not the situation, but how we handle the situation. I am glad to know that in the end Bathsheba received her blessing. Once again, this is confirmation that God is mighty enough to help us to conquer any battle, whether it is abandonment, abuse, rejection, or worthlessness.
Ladies, we serve a mighty, merciful God, how can you not keep falling in love with him over and over again!
Ladies,
I am enjoying the comments. I want to elaborate on something that Miriam mentioned about Nathan exposing David. It is comforting to me that everyone matters to God. David didn't value Uriah's life, but God did. The next time when a person in a position of leadership over you treats you poorly, whether it's a boss, husband or even a Church leader, They may not value you, but God does. We are all important and God despises those who hurt the innocent. Remember Matthew 18:6
when Jesus said "But if anyone causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a large millstone hung around his neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea". God really love us. :-)
Trina Whaley- I miss you girl. I know this comment isn't about Bathsheba, but I love you. I hope all is well with you and James. :-)
Look at me throughing out love on the WOB Book Club blog. :-)
Hi Ladies,
Sorry for blogging in so late, however, I would like to weigh in. My first thoughts were as some of you..... Bathsheba was minding her own business taking a ritual bath not knowing that she was being spied upon by the king. She did not refuse him. So what part did she play by giving in? I had mixed feelings about my answer to that. I then started to reflect on David and how the whole situation came about. My focus became on David because I think the way we respond with the men in our lives be it your spouse , your sons , brothers, brothers in christ, reflects on who we are as women. We are not really sure what would have happenned to Bathsheba had she refused him but she didn't and because of that it has put her character into question. Her character is in question because of her response. Our response of submission to spouses, our response to our son's, fathers and most importantly our Heavenly Father can and will put our character in question. Bathesheba and David both suffered for thier sin due to the loss of thier son. But was then blessed with Solomon. I don't think that she was totally innocent but I do think that David was totally wrong for not leaving well enough alone.
Hey ladies,
These were really great comments. They really make you think about the whole situation. I guess we'll never really know the whole story but at least we have different perspectives that can be appreciated. I think we sometimes think in one direction but when our eyes are opened up we can view things from different angles. I truly appreciate all of you. God is soooooooo good to us even when we make mistakes. Isn't wonderful to know we serve a God of second chances?
Roz, I miss you too. I am so grateful that we have this avenue of communication. It makes me feel like I'm at home with my sisters. I miss all of you so much!!
Faye, you are the bomb diggity girl. Thank you for getting us started again.
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